INOSANTO: I met Bruce at Ed Parker's International Championshipsin July 1, 1964. I started training with him immediatelyafterward. He was in the Southern California area, doingdifferent demonstrations, and he needed a partner for the demos.He said he would use me as the fall guy and would train me in hissystem, so that's what I did. Then he moved to Oakland,California, and I made periodic trips there to update mytraining.
BLACK BELT: You began training again with Lee when he returned toLos Angeles in November 1965, and the two of you opened a martialarts school in Chinatown in February 1967. Did Lee teach most ofthe classes?
INOSANTO: When the school first opened, I did the bulk of theteaching. Sifu Bruce taught 10 percent of the classes, and Iassisted him when he taught. He usually taught on Saturday andSunday. After the first year, he would come down once in a whileand check out the progress at the school.
BLACK BELT: How many students were enrolled when the school firstopened?
INOSANTO: I would estimate 22 or 24 people, including people like[Black Belt Hall of Fame members] Daniel Lee and RichardBustillo.
BLACK BELT: Who established the school's curriculum?
INOSANTO: I had some input, but the majority of the time, [Lee]controlled the curriculum at the Chinatown school.
BLACK BELT: Did the curriculum change often?
INOSANTO: Sometimes every three months, sometimes every sixmonths, sometimes every month. It fluctuated. There was a periodwhere [Lee] was changing it almost every month, particularly thewarm-ups. We had 10 exercises that we had to do, then he made it12. Then we doubled it by giving [students] a hard set and a softset. Then he changed it to skipping rope before practice. We dida lot of physical conditioning for one hour, then the last twohours it was all technical [training].
BLACK BELT: Were there certain topics you learned from Lee, butcouldn't impart to the other students?
INOSANTO: There were 13 things I could teach on the classicallist, and that was it. He used to say that under no circumstancescould I teach double pak sao (slap block). Pak sao bil jee (slapblock/ finger jab) and pak sao lop sao (slap block/grabbing hand)were big, big secrets. He was the head man, so I kept it exactlythe way he wanted me to teach it.
BLACK BELT: Did he tell you why he didn't want you to show thesetechniques to others?
INOSANTO: I never really asked him because he was the sifu. Hejust said "This is what I want," and I followed it.
BLACK BELT: Are you aware of anyone besides yourself, Taky Kimuraand James Lee who were certified directly by Bruce Lee to teachjeet kune do?
INOSANTO: To my knowledge, there were only the three of us,because that is something I asked Bruce.
BLACK BELT: Besides you, did Lee award anyone a third rank injeet kune do?
INOSANTO: No one other than myself, as far as I know, has beengiven a third rank instructor level in jeet kune do by Bruce Lee.He used this ranking system from 1965 to 1968 in all three of hisarts: jun fan gung fu, the tao of chinese gung fu and jeet kunedo. It went from blank circle as first rank, through variouscolor yin and yang symbols, to rank eight, which is the highestlevel. Eighth level is for the founder of the system. He begananother ranking system in March 1968 and then disbanded it in1969. In 1988, Taky Kimura and I decided to reinstate thisranking system. The blank circle represents a beginning student.The empty yin/yang symbol is for rank one, an intermediatestudent. Rank two is an advanced student eligible for apprenticeinstructor level. Rank three is for associate instructor level.Rank four is a full instructor, and rank five is a senior fullinstructor. Taky is rank seven, and he ranked me six. He reservedrank eight for Bruce Lee forever.
BLACK BELT: Is rank eight essentially unachievable?
INOSANTO: Yes, it's unachievable because only the founder is atthe top.
BLACK BELT: Your relationship with Lee went beyond student andteacher. You two were also close friends and did many thingstogether outside of the school, did you not?
INOSANTO: We did a lot of things together. We went to bookstores,we did a lot of research together, a lot of training. And we dida lot of sparring. I think I am correct in saying he didn't sparwith anybody as much as he sparred with me. He did a lot ofexperimentation on me.
BLACK BELT: Is it true that Lee kept records of how many hourshis private students trained with him?
INOSANTO: Yes, he was very meticulous about keeping records onwhom he taught.
BLACK BELT: Did you ever sit in on his private lessons with moviestars or notable martial artists?
INOSANTO: Yes, many times. I sat in on Steve McQueen's lessons. Isat in on one of James Coburn's lessons. I saw him train ChuckNorris. And I saw him train Mike Stone; he was very, verytalented, according to Bruce.
BLACK BELT: Did Lee object to the fact you continued to trainwith others in the Filipino Arts after you began training in JeetKune Do with him?
INOSANTO: He said it was good that I embrace my own cultural artof the Philippines, but [warned me not to] be bound by everythingFilipino just because I was Filipino. He said I should see thingsbeyond my own culture, and accept what is good and bad indifferent cultures and different [fighting] systems. He was theone who told me to take fencing for six months, which I did.
BLACK BELT: Did you ever show Lee some of the kali you hadlearned?
INOSANTO:Yes, I asked him what he thought of it. He told me whathe thought was good for theatrics or for show, and what hethought was good for fighting, and what he thought was good fornothing. He was very frank. If he thought something would neverwork in a hundred years, he would say so.
BLACK BELT: What did he like about kali?
INOSANTO: He liked a lot of the largo mano (long-hand style).
BLACK BELT: Did you introduce him to the nunchaku?
INOSANTO: Yes, and he became very proficient with it.
BLACK BELT: What other training equipment did you show to Lee?
INOSANTO: Because of my track&field background, I introducedhim to running shoes. Before that, he used to wear these desertboots. Using running shoes was quite new at the time. The onlypeople who wore those kind of gym shoes or sneakers during thatperiod were track&field people. Another thing I introduced tohim was the foam kicking shield, because we used it in football.I also introduced him to these forearm pads for use when youblock, but at first he didn't like them because he didn't likethe way they felt. But after about a week and a half, he had[created] all these drills with them.
BLACK BELT: Were you also responsible for Lee using baseball shinguards in his training?
INOSANTO: I introduced them to him, actually I put them on myselfbecause he was always kicking my shin.
BLACK BELT: How did Lee go about investigating various martialarts? There is so much information about each system that itwould seem to be an overwhelming task.
INOSANTO: He always said you should capture the essence of eachart. It's impossible to study every art, but you want to capturethe essence of each. It's like when you thumb through a book;that's what he was doing thumbing through the styles, seeing ifthere was anything he could fit into his personal system. Eithera training method, or progression, or training equipment, ormaybe some mode of technique that he could modify.
BLACK BELT: When did Lee change the name of his system from JunFan Gung Fu to jeet kune do, and what is the difference betweenthe two?
INOSANTO: The Jun Fan Gung Fu Institute was established [by Lee]in Seattle, so [the term] Jun Fan Kung fu [is used to indicate]the base system he had before he called it jeet kune do.Somewhere around the latter part of 1966 we began using the termjeet kune do, the "way of the intercepting fist" or the"way of the stopping fist."
BLACK BELT: When did Lee tell you to close the Los AngelesChinatown school, and why?
INOSANTO: He told me to close it in December of 1969. In Januaryof 1970, we moved the training into my backyard. I asked him if Icould teach a few people, and he said it was OK, but to keep itto just a few people. He wanted to keep it small and keep thequality high. His system was never made for mass distribution.
BLACK BELT: Do you feel Lee was progressing in his training rightup to the time of his death?
INOSANTO: There's no doubt about it. When I visited him in HongKong in 1972, I went there basically to train, even though hebrought me down there to be in [the movie] Game of Death. Beingin Game of Death was nice, but my main thing was to update [mytraining]. It was kind of nice; we had these mini-workouts inbetween cars, in between restaurants, walking up stairs. Some ofthe best things I ever learned from him was when we were eatingChinese food, because he would explain the system so I couldunderstand it mentally.
BLACK BELT: Do you think today's martial artists have a higherlevel of knowledge and skill than those of several decades ago,and if so, why?
INOSANTO: Yes, because people are more open, more giving. Thelevel of understanding is higher. Back in the '50s and '60s, ifyou just knew what a front kick was, it would throw people offbecause they were not exposed to kicking. They didn't know whatto do. If you started kicking, people would say "That'ssissy fighting" or "That's dirty fighting."Today's martial artists have seen a lot of Bruce Lee movies, alot of kung fu movies, so they are more educated. Any kid canthrow a kick now. The level of awareness is much higher everyyear, and it should be that way.
BLACK BELT: Do you think that, if Lee were alive today, he wouldstill be researching martial arts from around the world in aneffort to perfect his fighting system, or do you think he wouldbe satisfied that he had developed a finely honed finishedproduct and didn't need to investigate anymore?
INOSANTO: In my opinion, he would have always continued hisresearch. He said you shouldn't add to a system for the sake ofadding, but you should add for the sake of making it moreefficient. He said it isn't the accumulation of knowledge thatworks, but what you can do.
BLACK BELT: When Bruce Lee died in 1973, did you feel that theburden of preserving his feet kune do had been thrust upon yourshoulders?
INOSANTO: I would say yes, I felt the pressure. I tried to keepthe art very low-key, but a lot of people were opening up jeetkune do schools; everyone was doing it. These people weren't evenclose [to being legitimate JKD instructors]. They had seenpictures and tried to copy different things, and were calling itjeet kune do.
BLACK BELT: Do you teach the original Jun Fan/JKD?
INOSANTO: Yes. Let me explain this. We teach blend classes: inother words, a little bit of muay Thai, a little bit of savate, alittle bit of Jun Fan kickboxing, a little bit of trapping, alittle bit of Filipino weaponry where students can see what theywant to take. It is like an introduction course. There's astraight muay Thai class, a straight savate class, a straightshootwrestling class and a straight kali class. And we havestraight Jun Fan Gung Fu classes. The original material is taughtin these classes.
BLACK BELT: So the Jun Fan/JKD curriculum is taught separatelyfrom the other styles at your school?
INOSANTO: Absolutely separate.
BLACK BELT: What do you usually teach at your martial artsseminars?
INOSANTO: I teach whatever the host requests. If he wants silat,I teach silat. If he wants muay Thai, I teach muay Thai. If hewants Jun Fan kung fu, I teach Jun Fan Gung Fu. I don't teach JunFan Gung Fu mixed with silat, but I might make a comparison. Imight say "This is the way they do it in Jun Fan Gung Fu;and this is the way a muay Thai man might handle the sameattack." So the host dictates what I teach, because I amthere to help his knowledge and to help his students.
BLACK BELT: Do you think jeet kune do is designed for the averageindividual, or must you be a more skilled martial artist to trainin this highly advanced system?
INOSANTO: You definitely have to put in the [training] time, butif you are gifted and talented, it takes less time [to becomeskilled]. But the way jeet kune do is structured, there issomething in it that everybody can do. The majority of thingstaught in jeet kune do are relatively easy. Jeet kune do can bepracticed by a person who doesn't have the best inherent skills,and it can be practiced by an individual who is very talented.The person who is gifted is obviously going to do it much better.In other words, everyone can sing the same song, but some aregoing to sound a little better.